Scottish Independence... What are your thoughts?

[tonyreddevil]

Unbelievable

[astral276]

“Already several bilateral arrangements exist between the UK and the Republic of Ireland; joint funding arrangements between the UK Arts and Humanities Research Council and the Irish Research Council for Humanities and Social Sciences and an agreement giving the universities of Ulster and Queen's University Belfast access to the Republic's scientific research funding scheme work very well."

Why do the SNP always assume that because agreements exist between the UK and other countries that it naturally follows that similar agreements will exist between the UK and an independent Scotland? The SNP saying they will does not make it a fact. The UK could refuse similar agreements based on unique circumstances - or out of sheer bloody mindedness.

The bulk of the SNP case seems to be based on ifs and maybes. Hardly something to base the future of yourself and your descendants on - unless independence is more important to you than any other consideration.

I'm really hoping for a YES vote, it will be really interesting to see how many of the SNP promises come to fruition.

[DandC_Warehouse]

why keep bringing the snp into it?, Cancer Research UK have even said its bonkers.

[astral276]

why keep bringing the snp into it?, Cancer Research UK have even said its bonkers.

Errrr.... because as far as the drive for Scottish independence is concerned the SNP is pretty much it.

Are you saying that the SNP should not be mentioned on this thread?

Are the SNP now dictating what may be talked about? If so then eerily reminiscent of another Nationalist party. There are already reports of threats being made against people who do not follow the party line.

[tonyreddevil]

Why do the SNP always assume that because agreements exist between the UK and other countries that it naturally follows that similar agreements will exist between the UK and an independent Scotland? The SNP saying they will does not make it a fact. The UK could refuse similar agreements based on unique circumstances - or out of sheer bloody mindedness.

The bulk of the SNP case seems to be based on ifs and maybes. Hardly something to base the future of yourself and your descendants on - unless independence is more important to you than any other consideration.

I'm really hoping for a YES vote, it will be really interesting to see how many of the SNP promises come to fruition.

I'm hoping for a NO vote.Even though i cant vote.

[astral276]

I'm hoping for a NO vote.Even though i cant vote.

As I've said previously, I dont care either way. Just that the events following a YES vote will be far more interesting than those following a No vote.

[tonyreddevil]

As I've said previously, I dont care either way. Just that the events following a YES vote will be far more interesting than those following a No vote.

might be interesting if its a NO vote

[PetBazaar]

Why do the SNP always assume that because agreements exist between the UK and other countries that it naturally follows that similar agreements will exist between the UK and an independent Scotland? The SNP saying they will does not make it a fact. The UK could refuse similar agreements based on unique circumstances - or out of sheer bloody mindedness.

The bulk of the SNP case seems to be based on ifs and maybes. Hardly something to base the future of yourself and your descendants on - unless independence is more important to you than any other consideration.

I'm really hoping for a YES vote, it will be really interesting to see how many of the SNP promises come to fruition.

I think the endless positivity from the SNP is a campaign tactic in much the same way that the dreary pessimism is a No tactic. I also think that most people know (barring the keyboard Jacobites on one side and the blue rinse set on the other) that the reality will be somewhere in the middle. It just can't be any other way. When it comes to post-yes negotiations we'll win some and we'll lose some.

In some ways rUK actually has more to lose in an acrimonious split. With 10% of its GDP disappearing overnight the last thing it needs is a refusal for us to take a share of UK debt. It would probably cripple rUK's budget. Sure, Scotland would be a pariah for a while, but just like Iceland and Ireland we'd recover and being debt free would cancel out many of the negatives.

The thing is though, you've got to follow the vision of hope and aspiration. The alternative is the No campaign vision which, although branded as Better Together and Best of Both Worlds, is effectively saying you can only succeed if you continue to be kept afloat by England.

But both you and Tony are right. No matter whether it's yes or no, people in Scotland will be living in interesting times.

[astral276]

...the last thing it needs is a refusal for us to take a share of UK debt.

That's something I don't get. Scotland lays claim to a share of UK assets. If they refuse to take on a share of the debt then surely UK just retains assets to set against the debts - those debts (at the least in part) that were incurred in acquiring those assets.

No matter whether it's yes or no, people in Scotland will be living in interesting times.

How? In the case of a No vote then the absolute worst that can happen is for nothing to change. That is unlikely and further devolution of powers is the more probable scenario. That gives you a neutral to win outlook. Independence is a leap into the unknown. If the people of Scotland choose to take that leap then so be it, but with the vote looking to be close they will be dragging around 50% of the electorate in a direction they don't want to go. A more decisive result would be preferable, but does not appear to be on the cards.

[astral276]

BTW.... Given independence, does the UK get the money back that was granted to Scotland at the time of union? Worth about 7 billion as a share of GDP at today's prices - not including 308 years interest.